There is no hope.

When chemical evidence came to light that 9/11 was a false flag, I e-mailed several members of my family to inform them of perhaps the most literally explosive news they would ever hear in their lifetimes.

They simply weren’t interested.

Actually, that’s not quite true – they were a touch interested, in that they asked my not to send ‘political’ stuff like that to them again.

I’m sure you can imagine how I felt.

THE people you would expect to be the most sympathetic towards ‘one of their own’*, most receptive towards something relayed of utmost importance for all our benefit, something that was, and has been, affecting their lives since Sept 2001 (and actually shaped their lived before 2001 too!) with hard evidence-based logical impartial and unbiased science. But alas, it wasn’t to be. For what ever reason, they decided to continue living in the world that others had decided to project upon them.

Even with my own father; When I tell him of what I know about 911, it’s as if everything I say simply reflects off him, a kind of ‘thought mirror’ envelopes him, because surely every single thing that I say to him is just me repeating ‘conspiracy theories’, ‘read off the internet’. For example, we discussed on one occasion, about the kerosene/office fire temperatures melting the steel. I said hydrocarbon fires cannot melt steel, to which he responded ‘oxyacetylene?’. Sadly, for some reason I don’t know, I didn’t have the piece of mind to ask him something like ‘but there was no oxyacetylene!, only office furniture and kerosene’. Instead, I fell into his unintended ‘trap’ and kept in the oxyacetylene line and said something like ‘it will only melt steel with perfect fuel/air ratios and under pressure’ (to which he gave some suggestion that it was a valid point but otherwise made no inroads).

It’s not unknown for my father to play devils advocate on occasions, just to help one strengthen ones ideas and worm out problems etc, but here on the subject of 911, it was obvious nothing was impressing him.

From our conversations, I have to say I get the impression he thinks I’m simply blinding myself into something that will excuse the acts of Muslims (and by implication, Islam). For readers unfamiliar with ‘my story’, I am a revert to Islam, the only one (to my knowledge) in my family. I suspect this is a major factor in why they will not respond to the deadly serious implications of unchallenged research on 911 that shows 911 was an inside job.

I’m just guessing here but from what I’ve seen, the vast majority of Muslims I know believe 911 was an inside job, but the bulk of ‘Westerners’ (ill defined I know) don’t [note: a significant number of them do of course].

Actually. my Father has a point (if I read him right), that Muslims probably do have a predisposition to turn a  blind eye to things done by Muslims of in the name of Islam [yeah, I know the official version of 911 isn’t anywhere near as being Islamic] but Westerners have a predisposition to do the same – but from the other way around. Westerners overwhelmingly believe Western narratives, which basically boils down to what their state media tell them, and the employed professional liars and spin meisters that get (s)elected once in a while – usually 4 to 5 years or so.

The Muslim world is highly westernised, (yes, ‘he’ and ‘they’ have had enormous success) and although many many Muslims may believe 911 was an inside job, too many of them are too comfortable in their Westernised lifestyles to care to do much about it.

Even in cases like Iraq, although many were opposed to the war, very little was done about it. And certainty, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING effective was done about it.

We’ve had the MASSIVE economic frauds such as the LIBOR rigging scandal and AIB, MF Global etc, and still no one cares.

Almost daily, the evil Zionists occupying Palestine, kill and oppress more Palestinians and thieve their lands, but people allow themselves to be hopeful at “suggestions” of “peace talks” – how utterly ridiculous.

And as for Syria… I mean, bloody hell, the dirty Turkish leadership with it’s backpassage relationship with the lingering Zionist outbreak and Egypt (LOL at the ‘Muslim Brotherhood’ element of them) in collusion with the US,UK and France in bringing yet more pain and horror supporting the totally shit-for-brains savages pretending to be Muslim holy fighters in Syria. It’s utterly perverse that this alliance of evil has taken on board many Muslims across the planet as cheerleaders. Many Muslims do actually support the “rebels” and do believe they are fighting for an “Islamic state”. They have bought into the largely Western plus Totalitarian Saud portrail of it, that somehow it’s all about Sunni vs. Shia bullshit [Read this, I find it an excellent article]. I’m thinking of writing to the authors of Roget’s Thesaurus to have ‘Common Modern Muslim’ as a synonym to retard and idiot.

The  bottom line is, that almost everyone doesn’t give a damn, and those that do, like the ‘jihadists’ in Syria, who, while I admire their undoubted bravery, leave me laughing in contempt at the utter stupidity in their obnoxious and evil beliefs that have NOTHING to do with Islam, are far and few between.

Truly, we are on the road to hell and there is absolutely NOBODY that gives me the slightest bit of hope to believe that the coming total and massive doom can be avoided. This isn’t to say there are not people people unaware of all this, as there are!, but none of us seem capable to stopping this leviathan.

This post was triggered by the excellent article “Noam Chomsky is in Denial About 9/11 by Mark H Gaffney” – (http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article35595.htm) which captures what I regard as the hard evidence of 911. I’ve written about Chomsky’s incredible failings of 911 before, all the more astounding that a man with his knowledge of US and shitty little temporary israyhelli crimes (ok, he’s not that hard on israyhell), doesn’t prevent him from swimming in the pool of conventional narratives here.

Well, as the ‘titanic’ slips deeper into the unforgiving icy water, lets have the ships band play one of my fave feel good (and appropriate) songs…

*Re: The bonds and expected automatic sympathies of family, Perhaps I a have been subconsciously cut off or exiled from this, being a ‘black sheep’ having become a Muslim? Even my own sister has said on occasion (thinly disguised with half-hearted jest) that ‘you’re not going to blow anyone up are you?’ kind of questions.

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25 Responses to “There is no hope.”


  1. 1 felix July 21, 2013 at 9:16 am

    I notice that you haven’t commented on the most perspicuous nonsense peddled by the MSM regarding the Woolwich and Boston hoaxes, naturally with islamic overtonesb. Five seconds’ consideration of any available imagery shows what a load of nonsense the official narrative is, yet. And naturally, there has been mountains of publicly available analysis outside the MSM. People will slowly wake up to what’s happening with all these phony wars/attacks but it might take some time.

  2. 2 lwtc247 July 21, 2013 at 5:10 pm

    Hi Felix.
    Nice to hear from you again. You are right, I’ve not commented on the Rigby killing, or Rigby “killing” as some may choose to call it.

    It was primarily because I kind of gave up trying to get a handle on it due to there being so many claims and counter claims. This proceeded the Boston marathon bombing (BMB), and I must be honest with you, what I saw of “Proof: BMB is a hoax” type stuff, I was dismayed at just how bad it was. Sadly the Woolwich stabbing (WS) was pretty much the same,

    I feel very confident in the serious findings of 911 have gravitas (as does some of the unofficial 7-7 narratives) but not on the BMB and WS. I concede there may well be some good analysis out there, but I’ve yet to come across it.

    Re: BMB, In the end I ended up saying to myself… Yip, bombs went off, people died, but whether the two boys did it as patsies, or whether they really were terrorists or whether they really were framed, I simply don’t feel any confidence in coming to a conclusion. Although the patsy and framed have greater elevation in my mind.

    And for the WS, it’s kind of similar.
    There are many more weird things about the WS that unsettled me, for example, London – most CCTV’d city on the planet (so we’re told), and outside a military barracks, yet there seems to be absolutely no awareness inside the barracks of what was happening. How did these supposed two killers know that man was an Afghan war serving soldier?… the beheading that wasn’t (and therefore the bloodied hands that shouldn’t have been, which btw, two different cameras portrayed so weirdly differently) ….. and the unnoticed surveillance of Rigby (if any was done) went unnoticed etc… and on and on.

    What happened? I don’t know. I can’t rule out the possibility that the official narrative is correct: Two men killed Rigby for being part of an illegal force killing innocent Afghani’s. I can actually understand that (many pretend not to as it’s ‘taboo’ – In fact George Galloway alluded to something similar to bereaved Iraqi’s saying there is a case of some justification that they could take revenge on the killers of their loved ones ( – sorry, can’t remember the exact quote, but that was its essence).

    But these are very evil times (and as I say in the piece, it’s getting worse) and if they could do 911, if they could lie about Iraq (which of course they did, sacrificing British and US soldiers lives on a pack of lies) and if they did 7-7, then the BMB and WS is small fry in comparison.

    You can’t rule anything out.

    I think that ‘soldiers’ are thought of by the politicians (and their sponsors) as people that are paid to lay down their lives as the politicians (plus freakish cliques within) see fit, so having Rigby killed for “the greater good [sic]” in a “the means justifies the ends” kind of way, is probably normal to them, not requiring any degree of serious and grim thought on their behalf.

  3. 3 lwtc247 July 21, 2013 at 5:11 pm

    p.s. I updated article above (tried to fix some of the usual poor grammar).

  4. 4 Paul Taylor July 21, 2013 at 10:50 pm

    Felixw is right about woolwich, a very crude frame up by MI5 where two alleged Muslims ( African origin converts) commit a pointless act in an isolated street ( no shops nearby) and then give a absurd scripted press event to an EDL member who was allegedly on his way to a job interview .

    Note the white truck on double red , black woman shopper with trolley, absurd you people will never be safe , overthrow your government script) and Lee Rigby the hero of the hour with his help for heroes shirt that he never seemed to take off ( seen in a kebab shop with it two days earlier)

    I myself have given up with YouTube as its a stalked product that colludes with Israel and the NSA

    as for your Islamic faith , i think this harms your advocacy as you will be seen as ‘defending your own’ people will ignore all evidence that does not come with the stamp of authority. Your family are living in the ‘consensus trance’ as Peter Presland of wikispooks puts it. Most people are followers and will only change their opinions when it is safe to do so. facts , evidence etc are less important to them then the acceptance of others and the mass media have done an excellent job in pretending that a search for justice is some sort of ental illness. its also very depressing that your family are more convinced by the scripted opinions of people on telly than they are of people they know. its no compliment is it that your family ridicule and demean your opinions without even testing them for accuracy. after all it is a fact that kerosene fires CANNOT bring down steel and concrete skyscrapers . thats just IMPOSSIBLE and that in itself would prove the official stories false. how your father can suggest that somehow oxeacetylene proves the official narrative

    did Bin ladens men manage to gain access to 117 floors and prep the building for its cartoon collapse?

    sadly your family are fools who have been brainwashed by the mass media . they cant even do you the courtesy of examing your claims for accuracy. simply to suggest that because you are a Muslim your opinions can be dismissed’ its just a pity that they dont use a similar mindset while believing the Zionist owned media that promotes theories that are absolutely of advantage to Zionists , namely that it was Muslims who did it and not the Israeli /Neocon cabal .

    personally my opinion is that until we have economic collapse and until we get some kind of revelation from somebody in authority there will be no change and people will carry on believing the rubbish they are told however absurd

  5. 5 Paul Taylor July 21, 2013 at 10:55 pm

    as for Chomsky, he is Jewish, he is a sort of controlled opposition figure. he is there to try and control the extent of anti government opinion.

    fact is that anybody who fails to mention Israels leading role in terrorism is either censoring themselves or a stooge. sadly that now seems to exclude Webster tarpley who pretennds that this is all the work of Neo Cons and not Israel. Chomsky can be dismissed as of no consequence

  6. 6 lwtc247 July 22, 2013 at 3:20 am

    Hi Paul. Good t hear from you too. Hope you are well.

    You and Felix may well be correct, but I do wander why/how the unit responsible for bringing us these hoaxes (or false flags, i.e. someone was actually killed) go about things in such a manner that all these questions pop up. I find it hard to believe anyone could be that crap at doing it, and I find it hard to believe the deliberate invitation to alternative hypotheses is deliberately done. Having said that of course, the public en masse bought it, so maybe professionalism and finesse simply aren’t needed. If so, then it’s really a pretty big damning signpost of the current state of affairs.

    I love your ‘no shops’ comment, hahaha! :) Can’t have business effected can we, but really, scum that organises things like this wouldn’t give a toss about some small shops, and the bigger shops would have no knowledge/say up to all but the very highest of levels, and even then, the CEO of M&S for example (a strong financial contributor to evil israyhell) whilst most likely be not in the know, would just let the relevant ‘department’ do what it has to do to maintain the balance of fear, perhaps sacrificing a couple of days turnover for the guarantee of long term profits.

    Re: My faith. Indeed it does seem to interpose between people being able to absorb and expose information independently, which is a shame as when it comes to the wrong doings of people I generally don’t give any “Get of jail free cards” to anyone that talks bollocks or need to hear something. To me, the religion and a religions followers are as distinguishable as chalk and cheese.

    Re: My family, pretty much agreed as to what you say, but they never ridiculed me on it, not one bit. They are actually not idiots either, although on this issue and the way they live within the ‘consensus trance’ , I cannot but admit that they are behaving idiotically, and again to be accurate, by father wasn’t suggesting oxyacetylene was used, only that my statement ‘hydrocarbons don’t melt steel’ was perhaps incorrect. Also, they never openly said they dismiss what I say based on my choice of religious faith, but I do suspect it is a partially negating factor. Sorry if I didn’t make that clear earlier.

    Re: Whistleblower, I think the people in know would NEVER admit such a thing and it seems nobody is interested in supposed death bed confessions.

    Humm. I was going to say it’s strange that Wikileaks and Snowden haven’t had any access to info on 911 being an inside job, but it’s not that surprising after all I guess. The group doing it are likely to be quite small: SAS/MOSSAD unit type.

    Re: Chomsky, a lot of people say that about him, but I don’t know. Perhaps he is or perhaps he’s the subject of the very thing he identified. In an interview with the horrible Blairite lickspittle Andrew Marr, Chomsky suggested people are where they are today because the ‘background’ filtering system has allowed them to be there. In effect that if there was ever a person that would call govts to account then they simply would never have gotten to the position whereby they would ever be in a position to do so.

    John Pilger also doesn’t seem to buy into conspiracy theories and I’ve seen so much of JP to make me totally highly convinced that he’s not there to misdirect and obfuscate.

    No man is an Island, and maybe 911 is Chomsky’s (and Pilger’s) one time failure. It’s understandable perhaps, given the enormity of the implications involved, although there’s that nagging thing based upon what they write and lecture about, that in fact they actually want great global change – especially against the centres of rampant imperial power – which 911 has the potential to bring about.

  7. 7 Paul Taylor July 22, 2013 at 4:58 am

    i am ok now that I dont bother uploading to YouTubethe Zionists dont attack me very much apart from the occasional snide remark.

    as for shops the point i am making is that the location of the Woolwich episode is designed to reduce the possibility of independent witnesses. this is a location chosen as a good spot for this type of thing.

    Oxyacetylene is just an argument made similar to somebody i know who suggested that dresden was an example of fires bringing down buildings. as if brick and timber buildings that are firebombed with incendiaries are similar to steel and concrete ( in any event Dresden buildings did not collapse assymetrically , a fire can never do that under any circusmstances)

    Pilger still makes money in the mainstream so his opinions can be taken as self censorship

    the fact is that 9/11 really was an inside job and this is not dependent on the approval of Chomsky or Pilger

    as for Drummer Lee Rigby ( almost a made up name for a psuyop) assuming he really existed I think its more likely he died in a car crash, in training or on a mission and then his death was spun as a murder by Muslims. the idiotic Muslims with knives ( in left hands) chattingw ith various female ‘passers by’. this is a set up. the women passers by were just extras being used to create a vicarious witness scenario

    compare that event when one man ( a soldier) is supposedly killed with Anders Breivik a Norwegian Zionist who murdered almost 70 young people ( non military)

    fact is that the media show far more interest in promoting the anti Muslim agenda of teh Rigby episode than mentioning the Israel connection of the far more serious Breivik event

  8. 8 Paul Taylor July 22, 2013 at 5:06 am

    by the way there are very strong reasons to suspect Assange, his female rape accusers are both linked with Israel and visited Israel for a debriefing following the Assange accusations. a feature of Assange is that he wont blame Israel for 9/11 and that Wikileaks wont release any data on israel at all.it could be that its a ‘limited hangout’ when potentially harmful news is released in dribs and drabs. look at the net result of all these revelations/ NOTHING. nothing has changed, Google and the NSA carry on, Blair continues to rake in the cash etc

    there seems to be no limit to the amount of shit people wil take however my take is that regardless of the lack of backbone from the hoi polloi its still an individuals responsibility to take the high road.

    even if its just me and maybe you

  9. 9 Paul Taylor July 22, 2013 at 5:26 am

    I wish to give you a list of some of the most important documenatries about 9/11 and false flag terror in general, get a piece of paper and pen. many of these vids can be seen on YouTube but the best place is to use utorrent and a torrent search and download them and give them to anybody who is prepared to consider evidence on its merits

    in NO ORDER of preference but ALL vitally important

    Gladio, The power of nightmares, psywar, Human resources, war by deception, september clues, 9/11 octopus, Missing Links, The key to 911 ( Collin Alexander) No planes ( Collin Alexander) 9/11 demolitions, Zero, false flag ( german with English subs) In plane sight, 911 ripple effect, Blueprint for truth, experts speak out ae911, war by Deception, 911 press for truth, vancouver hearings,

    i was on jim Fetzers radio show recently , see the recent rever radio upload.

    regardless of the fact that we are clearly getting nowhere we must plough on. its often darkest before the dawn

    • 10 lwtc247 July 23, 2013 at 7:39 pm

      @Paul 4:58 am
      I get your point now about the location for the WS

      “Pilger still makes money in the mainstream so his opinions can be taken as self censorship” – Virtually all of us are in the “Matrix” Paul, you as much as I, that doesn’t mean we are compromised, but yes I’d have to agree, JP is self-censoring on the issue. My belief that no man is an Island sadly applies to JP also, painful though it is due to my great respect for him to denounce the sickening effects of power.

      “9/11 really was an inside job and this is not dependent on the approval of Chomsky or Pilger” – agreed, and this post is about there being no hope is because otherwise intelligent and decent people are in denial and there is no one “famous” enough to advance it

      I hate to say that, the truth isn’t validated by fame (or power or money) but fact of the matter is people are so adverse to thinking for themselves but a celebrity could change that Actually a movie star, footballer or soap-star would probably move the masses more than a Pilget or Chomsky.

      Good point about Rigby possibly dying before but was expediently ‘deathed’ in the WS. I never thought of that possibility before

      @5:06 am
      Assange’s lack of material on Israyhell is deeply troubling towards his credibility. HAve you seen this 108Moris108 video? It calls into question almost everything we are told http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_EuJnFnqD8 (Actually It’s a shame your video blogging halted – sorry I wasn’t able to help – maybe you could contact Morris to discuss it?)

      NOTHING has changed – fully agreed, my own personal reflections on a raft of these issues contributed to me writing this article wrote this there is no hope.

      @5:26 am
      I think I’ve seen most of all of them, but there’s one or two ‘new’ ones there for me to see Cheers In 2006 (and beyond), I distributed various videos, documents, documentaries and interviews and historical analysis to people to try and spread a bit of truth as I saw it. I hope it had some impact.

      Do you have a link to the Fetzer interview? Jim I believe proposed directed energy weapons as the cause of 911, amongst other things, causing a it of a split in the Intellectuals for 911 truth It was sad to see.

      I fully agree. even in the absence of hope we simply MUST press on. It’s the moral thing to do. To just give up would be a gross betrayal of oneself and to ones fellow man.

  10. 11 lwtc247 August 2, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    I just heard this today: Keelan Balderson interviewing with Tom Secker
    I have much sympathy with what the vast majority of Tom says in this interview, but as always seems to be the case with him, he completely ignores nasty little temporary israyhell for example when it said a foreign government requested surveillance of the alleged BB’s. (he will say because there is no evidence).
    He then peddles his own suppositions without has he rightly said before proper declaration of speculation. And as usual Tom takes the few ‘conspiracy sinners’ and uses them to generally smear any “truther” which believes something that he doesn’t or hasn’t endorsed e.g. about “connections between false flags and drills.

    I like Toms work and approach but it certainty isn’t the “pure logic” and “pure evidence” approach he spends a lot of time portraying it to be. He is blind to his own biases and omissions. Other than that, I like what he does.

    https://lwtc247.wordpress.com/2012/06/02/tom-secker-77-london-bombings-scads-2nd-conf-march-2012/

  11. 12 you know who August 2, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    Secker is a piece of shit and his work is of no value. He deliberately covers up for Israel. you wont find any truth at all in the state sponsored opposition.

    i think i wont bother posting additional comments. I regard you are as naive and your interest in religion is at odds with my personal philosophy

  12. 13 lwtc247 August 2, 2013 at 3:13 pm

    Ooops I forgot the link (audio only). Its: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOicoJCs_hY from http://wideshut.co.uk/

    I would agree J7T and its, dare I say, branch Dividians, do indeed cover up for Israyhell to the point that it stands out very obliquely indeed.

    I’m not sure why you bestow naivety upon me. Almost all people have their good points, J7T and Secker among them. Even if they are shills, they have to say some truth in order to be plausible and that should be absorbed. It’s a method I find quite useful, take the good and reject the bad. It’s also a good formula for general unity (amongst sincere people wishing to be united). It’s very easy to find something about someone that would cause ill feeling between folks, and to allow that to cause wholesale rejection of anything an individual does.. well, it’s not likely to yield much benefit. And some of the criticism I do find valid, like the within hours people ‘knew’ the BB was a conspiracy.(like much of what you find at the often irritating aangirfan site). I personally I got angry at people showing pictures of two different men while trying to pimp the lie that the man whose legs were blown off was a US soldier who was a known amputee. That was disgraceful.

    The above about taking the good and leaving the bad, applies equally to religion. I am astounded at how atheists (I was one formerly) and non-monotheists don’t accept the existence of God, but I don’t see how making negative remarks about it, or bring up the difference between us and allowing it to colour other things they say could yield much fruit.

    If you can accept political differences between people, why not accept religious differences – which can in some ways be thought of as a kind of super-politics.

  13. 14 felix August 4, 2013 at 6:05 pm

    Hi247, sorry I missed the continuation of the thread – I don’t get alerts for some reason….
    The weapon the PTB have is the use of fake deaths. We’ll never be able to prove them- pathologists, coroners, police, doctors are all paid public servants and can be leaned on or given inducements imho – but they must be a walk in the park. If people can fake their deaths by diy – almost, as the Panama two tried to – on their own, then it must be easy with all the state’s resources for a policital purpose. This is where your analysis falls down a bit, you assume real deaths. We cannot exclude use of doubles, faked photos, fake witnesses in any of these dubious cases. But with Boston, there is ample deep research of high quality to show it is all a load of nonsense, as is Woolwich. Try letsrollforums for example.

    It’s all about creating fear and enemies. No expense spared – and it’s our money being spent. Al Quaeda is fake. Wikileaks is fake. Edward Snowden is nonsense. Our MSM, controlled by shyouknowwho, is not going to question any weirdness in the news it is fed by “sources”. “It is thought” “we understand”…..all BS fed to us by those who control us. Trouble is, people are too busy in their lives to analyse the inconsistencies and weirdness which the MSM washes over them at times like Boston or Woolwich. “they wouldn’t do that would they?” is I guess hoi polloi’s rationalisation. They’re miles off the truth. Same goes with Libya, Syria, probably Afghanistan if we only could see more of the last…
    Aangirfan gives air to alternative theories to the MSM one. Why in any case ought there to be anything weird about a story if the truth is being told? Traffic signs that don’t suffer a scratch when a car is wrecked crashing into it?? What about the San Francisco plane crash? It doesn’t get much weirder than that. No need to get into asking why, perhaps these are all experiments in perception of media reporting for the next big one? b

    • 15 lwtc247 August 4, 2013 at 11:10 pm

      Cheers Felix. The lack of real proof exists both ways, but I see two camps here. One that assumes just about everything violence related is a false flag, and other that believe everything the govt says. Surely it’s unlikely that one of those camps is solely correct.

      To date the BB ‘conspiracy proof’ that I’ve seen has been very shoddy, and in cone cases conemptable, but I’ll try and check out the source you mention.

      I see tonnes of BS daily pass infront of my eyes which gets passed off as “news” and the weasel words that you menton which punctuate it, eg “sources”. “It is thought” “we understand” etc, but again, can it ALL be fake? Is Bradley manning fake? Is Assange having a great time in the box known as the Ecuadorian embassy. Is there actually NO REAL resistance that makes it into the news?

      “Why in any case ought there to be anything weird about a story if the truth is being told” – Is it not the nature of farty humans, especially with deadlines looming, that absolute accuracy and consistency of narratives is an unreasonable expectation? As well as these news hacks already been filtered by the fact they have been given employment, been retained and climbed their way up to the level where they can make mind steering ‘reports’. (it’s the journos AND the editors)

      If there are psychopaths running most of our lives (and there are) in the global elite, then why can’t there be psycho’s of a different/independent stream also in the picture, or even bona fide “anarchists”/”terrorists” which like the ridiculous Syrian ‘jihadi’s’ have just simply got it wrong, and say. Surely not all psycho’s are members of the powers that be – especially if they are poor.

      Re: Aangirfan. His postings irk me on many occasions, like the way he ‘knows’ the complete picture withing just 72 hours, all from his armchair, without any forensic evidence. His instant conclusions and alternative narratives are peppered with too made side unrelated threads, rumour and speculation. I wisk I could know everything about everything in 72 hours.

      I’m not saying Woolwich or the BB is as the official narrative paints it, but I see room for such things to occasionally be that way the corporate media tell it (pretty much).

      I’ve not looked into the asiana airlines crash. I wasn’t aware there as anything fishy about it. Neither have a looked the Michael Hastings alleged crash, but a strange video purporting to show the car blew up before it err actually blew up was quite ridiculous.

      I’m beginning to think these ‘minor’ conspiracies are meaningless in the sense that really if 911 doesn’t open peoples eyes (and that should be the focus) then ‘fresh’ minds are unlikely to adopt threadbare theories e.g. the supposed Hastings video, as a signal that there’s something very wrong with this world. In fact, one could argue there’s a conspiracy to pump out minor (straw man) conspiracies to stop people looking at the 911 definite conspiracy and alerting people to it. Which of course ALL leads to shitty little temporary Israyhell.

  14. 16 felix August 5, 2013 at 2:42 pm

    247 – I really think that even the most junior Guardian, Sun or Telegraph reporters know they are passing off inconsistencies which wouldn’t satisfy a ten year old, deadline or no. They aren’t stupid. Every “outrage” ought to be subjected to an immediate deep scrutiny. I don’t think it is helpful to set a default mode that the story is genuine. That’s why I find aan helpful, on a take-it or leave-it basis. At Woolwich, for example, why were key witness tweets deleted,even though they were all over the press, having done their job? Woolwich was a perfect example of a hoax – fake witness statements pushed out by the MSM, add Cobra into the mix, and then there’s no going back. It’s all nonsense.

    We should be examining these minor psyops / hoaxes; they have a purpose. They can’t be meaningless otherwise spend so much on them. Perhaps your last two sentences are getting close to the truth.

    Real resistance wouldn’t make it to the MSM imho. Hence my suspicion of Assange, weirdo Snowden & co.

    Do dig deeply into Boston – it’s all there. [that “massacre” i in the Alps was another I would pigeon hole as a psy-op]

    I first noticed lwtc following your Kelly piece. Kelly had links with Israyhell, not just Bahai. fwiw I think there was some kind of extraction, reason unknown followed by a huge and expensive cover-up.

    Loads of MSM stories satisfy me; in fact almost all of them – strange thing is they never involve “terism” or “outrages”.

  15. 17 you know who August 6, 2013 at 12:53 pm

    the default position for ALL mass media is that its IMPOSSIBLE that the government is involved. my analysis shows me that the default position should be that unless the evidence can be shown otherwise all major teerror events are government psyops

    felix is much closer to the truth than the owner of this blog.

  16. 18 lwtc247 August 6, 2013 at 6:21 pm

    Maybe I’ll try to give you more appreciation as to my current view.

    There must be a few billion people on this planet that have a reason to be angry at the greedy elite and the overlords that encourage them to keep the rotten system going, allowing them to keep the rotten fruits plucked from the tree of death. Many of the oppressed will surely have very strong reasons to act on that anger and ‘lose it’ in seeking revenge, or even from a sense of sacrificial altruism.

    A number of people who have ‘lost it’ have have made their way to Syria and are busy slaughtering innocent people and trying to bring about a perverse form of tyranny with an Islamic label plastered over it – to their immense shame. Can you really not understand that people who might do such a thing would never conduct an act of “terrorism” against people they consider to be “infidels”? – when in fact that’s precisely what they are doing in Syria against MUSLIMS? And then we could consider scum like Anders Breivik or Baruch Goldstein ad nauseam.

    I can imagine that. Perhaps because you cannot, you will not.

    Of course, whether or not it has actually transpired is a totally different story. One has to say 911 definitely wasn’t such a thing. It was an inside job. LIHOP is incredibly weak, as is the case with 7-7 (despite my reading of J7T’s that they are pushing this ‘patsies line’), and Rachel North trying to cover a different base with the ‘genuine terror incident, but bungled security services operation’ line.

    Re: the BB and the WS: Given the inconsistencies I’ve come across, I feel one is more likely to get the truth by assuming it is of the false flag / black-op variety (a la Gladio), BUT, in these two ‘events’, there are alleged perpetrators who have been (supposedly)caught. There was a ton of conspiracy drivel a bout the BB’s but on the other hand, very real reasons not to accept the ‘official line’, e.g. family of the alleged BB talking of CIA connections, suggesting the a patsy/innocent dupe/pawn/frame-up scenario. As for the WS, there’s been a fair chunk of crap about that too Both these cases, based on the “conspiracy proof” that I’ve seen so far doesn’t convince me that it was a conspiracy, although that my my default position. I’ve not looked at the stuff Felix has pointed to yet.

    But let’s assume it was a false flag or even a total bit of theatre. Where does it get me (or anyone) that brings me to a stronger position that can be arrives at by studying 911 and bringing peoples attention to that?

    I don’t think it does afford a stronger position, in fact, if anything, it may bring one to a weaker position, as these events could easily be interjected into a discussion of ‘look at the dirty dealing which the establishment mete out’ conversation. In doing so, a whole wad of greatly unsubstantiated gossip and theories and in some cases sheer falsehoods initiated/propagated by some internet armchair ‘expert’ (and naturally, the panZionist disinformation agents putting up strawmen)

    Aangirfan has a use, but his modus operadi, which I’ll catchphrase to 772 hours to know everything’ is lame and quite immature. [Has he ever re-addressed past posts, amended errors, scotching any possible myths within them etc?] That’s all I have energy to say about him right now.

    I find it a bridge too far to adopt a “100% pure theatre” stance, although I can live with the play unravelling before us being highly (or even 100%) SPUN.

    I may be wrong, as may you, but that’s my current take on these things.

    I think our aims are pretty much in sync here. Who exactly is subjectively [for it IS greatly subjective] closer to the truth shouldn’t really occupy most of our effort.

  17. 19 Virgil August 24, 2013 at 6:26 pm

    “When I tell him of what I know about 911, it’s as if everything I say simply reflects off him, a kind of ‘thought mirror’ envelopes him, because surely every single thing that I say to him is just me repeating ‘conspiracy theories’, ‘read off the internet’. For example, we discussed on one occasion, about the kerosene/office fire temperatures melting the steel. I said hydrocarbon fires cannot melt steel, to which he responded ‘oxyacetylene?’. Sadly, for some reason I don’t know, I didn’t have the piece of mind to ask him something like ‘but there was no oxyacetylene!, only office furniture and kerosene’. Instead, I fell into his unintended ‘trap’ and kept in the oxyacetylene line and said something like ‘it will only melt steel with perfect fuel/air ratios and under pressure’ (to which he gave some suggestion that it was a valid point but otherwise made no inroads).”

    So are you suggesting that structural engineers don’t understand their own field? From a Popular Mechanics article:

    http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/debunking-911-myths-world-trade-center

    “Melted” Steel

    Claim: “We have been lied to,” announces the Web site AttackOnAmerica.net. “The first lie was that the load of fuel from the aircraft was the cause of structural failure. No kerosene fire can burn hot enough to melt steel.” The posting is entitled “Proof Of Controlled Demolition At The WTC.”

    FACT: Jet fuel burns at 800° to 1500°F, not hot enough to melt steel (2750°F). However, experts agree that for the towers to collapse, their steel frames didn’t need to melt, they just had to lose some of their structural strength—and that required exposure to much less heat. “I have never seen melted steel in a building fire,” says retired New York deputy fire chief Vincent Dunn, author of The Collapse Of Burning Buildings: A Guide To Fireground Safety. “But I’ve seen a lot of twisted, warped, bent and sagging steel. What happens is that the steel tries to expand at both ends, but when it can no longer expand, it sags and the surrounding concrete cracks.”

    “Steel loses about 50 percent of its strength at 1100°F,” notes senior engineer Farid Alfawak-hiri of the American Institute of Steel Construction. “And at 1800° it is probably at less than 10 percent.” NIST also believes that a great deal of the spray-on fireproofing insulation was likely knocked off the steel beams that were in the path of the crashing jets, leaving the metal more vulnerable to the heat.

    But jet fuel wasn’t the only thing burning, notes Forman Williams, a professor of engineering at the University of California, San Diego, and one of seven structural engineers and fire experts that PM consulted. He says that while the jet fuel was the catalyst for the WTC fires, the resulting inferno was intensified by the combustible material inside the buildings, including rugs, curtains, furniture and paper. NIST reports that pockets of fire hit 1832°F.

    “The jet fuel was the ignition source,” Williams tells PM. “It burned for maybe 10 minutes, and [the towers] were still standing in 10 minutes. It was the rest of the stuff burning afterward that was responsible for the heat transfer that eventually brought them down.”

    ————————
    You don’t have to have any faith or trust in big (and corrupt) governments to find the conspiracy theories surrounding 9/11 less than credible.

  18. 20 lwtc247 August 24, 2013 at 8:04 pm

    Hi Virgil.
    I’m talking about melted steel period. Not of any claimed cause or effect of molten steel.

    It seems like popular mechanics don’t seem to understand the whole point, bolting on a specious point of the ’cause’.

    Anyway, to engage, Is anyone seriously claiming that structural steel – that which was used in the towers – loses enough strength to enable total collapse (chiefly by pulverisation and not listing)? in a kerosene fire?

    Wouldn’t that in effect render it utterly unsuitable for construction? and mean that diesel fuel generators should be outlawed in and around such structures? (NPP designers take note!) and that jet fuel fires indeed managed to burn at their maximum reputed temperature (with perfect oxygen balance, fuel supply and exposure and duration and so forth).

    And NIST seriously expects us to believe that rugs, furniture, paper and curtains could, bring down a building made of construction steel (they don’t need kerosene to start burning) is frankly ludicrous. rugs, furniture, paper and curtains, like hydrocarbon fed generators need to be outlawed too.

    Simply ridiculous.

    No need to spend millions on demolition crews, just fill a lower floor of a steel framed building with rugs, furniture, paper and curtains, set the thing ablaze and after a short time watch the structure pulverise into a not too bad pile.

    Anyway, “Bechtel engineers, responsible for safety at Ground Zero, wrote in the Journal of the American Society of Safety Engineers: “The debris pile at Ground Zero was always tremendously hot. Thermal measurements taken by helicopter each day showed underground temperatures ranging from 400ºF to more than 2,800ºF.”[1]. The narrative should be changed then to “the 19 arab hijackers armed with box-cutters and magic carpets…” the magiv caprets being the things that magically bumped the temperature even higher. to 2,800oF.

    Of course the nanothermite residues that were independently found in the dust of the WTC collapsed buildings would be a much better and intellectually satisfying answer rather than rugs, furniture, paper and curtains oh my.

    [1] http://www.ae911truth.org/news/41-articles/347-high-temperatures-persistent-heat-a-molten-steel-at-wtc-site-challenge-official-story.html

  19. 21 lwtc247 August 24, 2013 at 8:05 pm

    Evidence of Molten Metal at World Trade Center

  20. 23 Virgil August 25, 2013 at 3:49 am

    You keep talking about a total melting, when that wasn’t necessary in order for the structures to collapse:

    http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/engineering/4213805

    “The North and South Towers of the World Trade Center weren’t knocked down by planes—they both stood for more than a half-hour after the impacts. But the crashes destroyed support columns and ignited infernos that ultimately WEAKENED—not MELTED—the steel structures until the towers could no longer support their own weights (NIST offers a primer here). Ms. O’Donnell fundamentally misstates the case with her use of the word “melted” “

  21. 25 lwtc247 August 25, 2013 at 1:34 pm

    “You keep talking about a total melting, when that wasn’t necessary in order for the structures to collapse” – and you keep taking about your own pesonal add-on to what I’m talking about, as I’ve already pointed out.

    The thing about the “molten steel” is that there must have been something present to melt it. Nothing normal in the construction of a building could have done this. The elemental analysis would (and has) reveal the presence and abundance of these elements responsible for melting it. X-ray florescence and as well as other particulate analysis (electron microscopy) all of which is said to be consistent with nano thermite. You could of course reject all this (although I don’t know what scientific basis you would have for rejecting it) and stick with NIST’s chemical analysis if they had bothered to do any. Did they? I’m not aware of any.

    And the Koh-i-noor of this is of course WTC7, with it’s near perfect uniform collapse despite NOT being hit by a plane and (according to reports) having virtually all its small fires extinguished.

    I’ll read the link you gave at length later, but a quick scan of it leaves me cringing “According to ‘truthers’, this molten material came from one of a score of devices planted on every floor,” a pretty poor start :s


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